The shift is simple all MIT/Harvard/Stanford/U Berkley or whatever EE/CS/Math/Physics etc majors actually want to start startups as oppose to go to IB (as back in 2005). Why waste your youth working 80 hours a week for some one else when you can start startup, and cashout north of 10m in couple of years?
I didn’t know there was a reliable way to start companies and cash out $10 million in a couple of years. More likely, you graduate from MIT or Stanford with a CS degree, start working for Google for $80k a year, and then max out at $300k after 10 years. Even today, if you make it to IB, your expected earnings are probably higher than those of (good) computer programmers.
The problem is, there is now a scarcity of jobs in investment banks that put you close to the money. Going into IB is not a reliable career choice as statistically, you will fail to get the job you want. If you have a CS degree from a top tier school and graduate with a 3.7 GPA, I guarantee that you can get a job in a big tech company. However, there is no such guarantee for anyone who wants to do IB nowadays.
I agree with ohai csk, what you are talking about is a 6 std event. I have worked in both investments in both front office and tech in engineering. It is an extreme event when a startup is sold for millions. It is a risk vs return kind of situation why the payoffs are so high.
+10
Given the much higher failure risk of landing that desired finance job these days, the probability adjusted future payout of investment banking is probably equal to or below the CS degree.
Finance on the whole is dying, and not to mention hated by the general public. A huge dramatic shift from less than a decade ago, when it was looked upon as the golden career to be in. Madoff, the mkt crash, financial meltdown, fraud, rogue traders, insider trading explosion, govt bailouts, and now LIBOR scandals… It looks bad. can’t deny it.
If you really want a stable job with little risk and still somewhat finance related… do Accounting. You may work long hours and have little bonus, but you’ll almost certainly have a job.
This is the standard advice that’s given to white/chinese/indian males that are applying to Harvard/Stanford/Wharton/Columbia/MIT. Getting into one of these schools with a sub-700 GMAT would be a really remarkable achievement.
However, if you’re talking about business schools in France/Spain/etc, that is an entirely different situation. These schools are not what the ~750 GMAT rule of thumb is referring to.
Das me bro! Top 3, or just saw the whole pecker off.
European b-schools aren’t as nearly as selective as the top U.S. ones. One reason is that in Europe, an MBA is not rquired for transition into the various industries. Also, the top people, even in Europe, prefer to do an MBA at an elite American school.
I have a white male friend who got into Booth this year with a $20K/year scholarship, despite a 2.7 gpa and 700 gmat from a very mediocre undergrad.
He must’ve worked for Goldman at some point.
Itera hit the nail on the coffin. It is unbelievable how much fluff there is in top MBA admissions. The guy I mentioned above who got into Booth is a white male who got dinged the year before. He was supposed to attend a top 15 MBA program but dropped out before classes and moved to an emerging market to work on a wine and food startup for a few months and managed to parlay that into a booth acceptance. I know tons of people who f*cked around abroad and managed to fluff their resumes and gain admission.
MBA adcom for the most part is very politically driven; if you fit a certain “exotic” niche, you have a good shot at getting in.
Totally Agree. I have this friend who just couldn’t break 630+ on the GMAT, and after multiple failures, he realized his shot at a top 5 US MBA school was dead. So he found out apprently Cambridge doesn’t even look at GMAT scores, and he applied and got in easily. They have no campus recruting or it’s so crappy it’s basically worth nothing. Now he has an MBA, and realized he actually isn’t far off from where he was pre-MBA lol
Auto hacksaw. no question about it.
This is why CT should apply to a US program, he definitely has the “exotic niche” part down. This sort of experience is pretty uncommon.
I agree. With the exception of HBS and Stanford, a low gpa by itself is not a deal-breaker. I know a decent number of people with sub-3.3 GPAs who got into the likes of wharton/mit/columbia/booth/kellogg.
Nope. He worked for an equity daytrading firm for 5 years and then was set to attend a top 15 U.S. mba program before dropping out to do a startup in an emerging market country. He got into booth and dinged at kellogg, columbia, tuck, haas, stern, yale.
Lots of MBA hate. Disrespect.
Lol.
DBA or the hacksaw. Amirite?
Is this the very first reference to “rusty hacksaw”?
^ No, I first coined the rusty hacksaw when you and Itera went into it one time. You asked some seemingless innocent question and Itera chimed in saying something in so many words, “No you didn’t go to a top 5 MBA program, dont’ waste your time trying.” I then took it a step further saying, “Yeah, Greenie, you didn’t go to a top 2 program. Just saw your sack off with a rusty hacksaw ASAP.” The coined phrase worked and caught some traction.
I’d be impressed if you could find that thread. Itera replied back with, “Um, exaggerate much?”
Congrats!
I really appreciate your post because a lot of people, here especially, over exaggerate how difficult it is to get into a good MBA program and this and that… like you have to be a superman or a member of the skulls or a presidential candidate to be in the running.
That’s what I thought. But I scoured high and low for it, and couldn’t find it. Do old threads “die” after a year or something?