The problem with an MBA is that on graduation, you’re automatically excluded from many of the entry jobs you wanted. IB Analyst, ER Analyst… etc MBA grads are expected to get into the industry at the associate level (with higher pay of course), and firms would rather hire a undergrad from a top school than an MBA. I’ve seen people with master’s and MBAs purposely take it off their resume when applying for the entry level jobs they want. It’s sad.
This thread blows a load. Blackbelt would not have even been looked at had he not passed L2 after studying 1000 hours for it yet has the nerve to disregard the usefulness of the designation
^ I totally agree. OP you are the biggest hypocrite ever. I went through search and dug up YOUR OWN POST: These are YOUR OWN WORDS: CFABLACKBELT Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > IMO it depends. Studying for the CFA has given me > a solid base in finance in ways that my college > degree never could even come close to. The CFA > also helped me land my research gig. It was by no > means a major factor, but def. helped weed me out > from the rest of the crowd. > > What a complete waste college was… So now that you’re in the industry (thanks to your painful CFA studying) you now say how “useless the CFA is”. It GOT you the job, and you turn around and trash talk it? Just get out.
So let’s see… People who actually work in the industry in desirable jobs say that the material in the CFA program is anywhere from “not that useful” to useless. Bitter haters on the sidelines who studied for hundreds of hours and can’t break in, or have marginal jobs in the industry, or haven’t studied for the CFA at all say that it is useful, mostly to assuage their own egos (apparently) and justify the time spent. That’s all you need to know right there. You can try to turn this into a thread about whether the CFA will help you get a job, but that’s just a lame attempt to confuse the issue. The fact is that a person who spent the same 750+ hours studying concepts that matter could likely get the same job by submitting relevant research samples, etc. In case you’re wondering, that happens frequently in real life for the kind of analyst roles people actually want.
^ This is the most full of sh*t post I’ve ever seen, and I work in the industry. bromion Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > So let’s see… > > People who actually work in the industry in > desirable jobs say that the material in the CFA > program is anywhere from “not that useful” to > useless. Wrong. > > Bitter haters on the sidelines who studied for > hundreds of hours and can’t break in, or have > marginal jobs in the industry, or haven’t studied > for the CFA at all say that it is useful, mostly > to assuage their own egos (apparently) and justify > the time spent. > False. > That’s all you need to know right there. You can > try to turn this into a thread about whether the > CFA will help you get a job, but that’s just a > lame attempt to confuse the issue. No, it’s not. > The fact is > that a person who spent the same 750+ hours > studying concepts that matter could likely get the > same job by submitting relevant research samples, > etc. No. Wrong again. > In case you’re wondering, that happens > frequently in real life for the kind of analyst > roles people actually want. BS
greengrape Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > ^ This is the most full of sh*t post I’ve ever > seen, and I work in the industry. If you have a real argument, please feel free to post. Otherwise, you sound like one the bitter haters.
You guys are all gay
interesting let the debate continue in earnest …i have nothing meaningful to add but encourage others with more experience to chip in
pimpineasy Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > interesting let the debate continue in earnest > …i have nothing meaningful to add > but encourage others with more experience to chip > in i contributed.
CFA material provides a thorough, solid foundation for a career as a financial analyst. Regardless of whether you disagree with EMH or invest with your gut feeling and has never built a DCF in practice, you need to have this basic level of competency under your belt. If you truly believe the material is “worthless” and are not saying this just for shock factor, you’re likely a joke
Many enlisted men also think the stuff in officer training schools and the military academies are good for getting ahead in a military career, but are completely worthless in practice. All that really matters on the battlefield is whether you can shoot and have experience. If they had a forum like this, there would certainly be a thread like this. Are you planning to be officers or are you planning to be grunts? That should affect your attitude to the CFA material.
If CFA is worthless, MBA is useless and a finance degree is waste of time and money so where should you learn the skills and knowledge? Work experience? but the very first day that you start your work you should know something and be able to offer something. Where do you get that? Maybe CFA is not everything you need to know but I guess as a ER you should be able to read and interpret a balance sheet. CFA teaches you how to do that but certainly it doesn’t tell you what is important in mining, pharma or retail industry. For that you need specific knowledge of that industry. CFA doesn’t tell you how to sell your idea at work but it’s not supposed to do that. It’s irrelevant to the value of a stock.
Mobius Striptease Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > CFA material provides a thorough, solid foundation > for a career as a financial analyst. Regardless of > whether you disagree with EMH or invest with your > gut feeling and has never built a DCF in practice, > you need to have this basic level of competency > under your belt. If you truly believe the material > is “worthless” and are not saying this just for > shock factor, you’re likely a joke Finally something i agree on. That and suggestion for sub to get a girlfriend
This is a ridiculous discussion. To say that the CFA is not relevant for a fund is asinine (or even sell side); btw- I’ve worked as an analyst/jr port manager on a long/short quant/fundamental fund) I believe it’s important but not the limit; certainly, analysts need to get additionally more granular; deciding to stop your financial learning curve beyond the CFA is just lazy and won’t work spectacularly well in this employment environment.
^agree with Keys and greengrape here because 2 people on this forum who have collectively worked in the industry maybe 5 years say it is useless means absolutely nothing. just because your fund doesn’t use DCF for valuations does not mean it is not used. I have talked to HFs that do use DCF as one of their main valuation measures. what now?
The CFA provides a broad base of knowledge that can be built upon for a lot of different jobs in this industry. It’s not meant to be a training program for SS analysts. CFAI probably COULD make 20 different designations, each focused on a specific job function, but that would water down the value of the broader designation because everyone would just focus on their own area of concentration and ignore the rest. Just because you don’t specifically use something like interest rate parity (or whatever else), that doesn’t mean your understanding for the topic hasn’t in some way helped you learn or understand something that DOES matter to your job. We are constantly building upon past knowledge and experience in everything we do. It’s easy to think of the top layer as knowledge as all that matters. You often think that way because it’s the most visible and easiest to recall. The thing is, that top layer of knowledge wouldn’t be as strong if not for the other sh!t underneath it.
I have talked to HFs who barely even do their own research, they go online and post challenges on message boards asking people to pitch stocks and value them. If the pitch is selected, the poster gets paid a small amount.
sjv1030 Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > > An academic degree is there to teach things in a > vacuum (to an extent) and to make sure the > foundation is there so one can build on it with > work experience/knowledge. > > Therefore, I agree with Bro and BlackBelt that the > CFA designation isn’t really carrying its weight > in that regard. It shouldn’t try to replace the > education learned in a Masters of Finance program > or an MBA program. > > I personally work in ABS, and can tell you that > CFAI is really behind on this stuff. Yet, I read > all these reports from S&P and Moodys from analyst > with their CFA charters and wonder what benefit > they got from it. I’m studying for level 2 and > the MBS/ABS section is weak. Actually, my Masters > in Finance taught me more of a foundation. In > that regard, the FI section of level 2 is > completely useless IMO. If you think the MBA gives you a stronger financial foundation than the 3 levels of the CFA, you most likely don’t have an MBA, haven’t completed the CFA, or even both. (And yes I’m right, you didn’t even pass L2 yet, and it sounds like you don’t have an MBA) MBA’s only true value comes in networking and on-campus recruiting. In terms of real technical foundation, it’s a sad joke in comparison. You work in ABS. Yea, I worked in ABS before for 2 years now I’m in Equity Research. ABS is a small section in the fixed income book. Obviously it’s not going to be that useful to you, the vast majority of CFA charterholders are in Asset Mgmt or ER. Our work touches on these books: Equities/FRA/Econ/CorpFin/Ethics/Quant And while that small ABS section obviously can’t explain the entire complexity of ABS, it is definitely a good beginning introduction to the business and gives people a awareness of what it’s about, and how it works.
Palantir Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I have talked to HFs who barely even do their own > research, they go online and post challenges on > message boards asking people to pitch stocks and > value them. If the pitch is selected, the poster > gets paid a small amount. Interesting. I wonder if the clients of that HFs aware of that the HFs use this strategy.
rezam71 Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > If CFA is worthless, MBA is useless and a finance > degree is waste of time and money so where should > you learn the skills and knowledge? Work > experience? but the very first day that you start > your work you should know something and be able to > offer something. Where do you get that? Agreed. If this thread was an Excel workbook, it would be one big circular reference warning.