Blacks now account for 2.3 percent -about one in 45 - of the firm’s brokers and broker-trainees, McCann said. “Am I happy with 2.3 percent of my FAs being African-Americans?” he said. “No.” McCann also conceded that “there is an over-representation of African- American FAs in the lower quintiles” of production. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Rationality is on exactly one side of this argument. And it’s not the side that’s advocating that a firm hire more people who are statistically more likely to be poor performers in this particular industry. Sounds to me like ML is in the game to win the game, which is how it should be.
boston_level2_candidate Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > > let me guess…oskigo is a financial advisor. it > doesn’t make one bit of sense to spend $5000 on a > $100,000 purchase of mutual funds. that’s the > silliest thing in the world. > > also, the wrap account at UBS was called PACE, and > it had a 1.5% fee associated with it (in ADDITION > to the 1.4% that the average equity mutual fund > charged). very STEEP! but you could do many > transactions, and that was ok, but ~3%!!! > > > why not put your money at fidelity, and pay less > than 1%? > > Oskigo, 1% < 3%. > > FAs that I’ve seen are stupid, jock-types, and the > ones with staying power there, are very handsome, > sneaky, liars. > > anyone who isn’t photogenic, tall and handsome > will not survive here. Oh yes, it helps to come > from a rich family (and good looking) and not a > minority, such as Indian, Chinese, Black, > Hispanic. Believe me. I am not a FA, but I deal with many from time to time and many are very bright guys who run their own accounts (some *gasp* even with CFA charters). and as for the 100K comment clearly you didn’t read my posts since i’ve repeatably said that anyone under a mil liquid shouldn’t invest with a FA. you guys were clearly picked on in school and jealous that FAs can make 400K a year working 40 hours a week while you guys are working on your spreadsheets working 80 hours a week making 60k a year.
aaaahhhhaaahhahahahhahahahaahaaaa!! Yeah I’ve been bullied my whole life, when will it stop, waaaaaahhhh!! Gimme a break. And the FA is jealous of the crack dealer making 400k workin 5hrs a day…la de da… Believe me, there is no jealousy in my heart, I don’t care if they made a cool mil a year. Maybe you could clarify what “run their own accounts” means for me?
it means they do research, buy stocks and bonds on discretion, and charge a fee. and many even beat the S&P on a regular basis. just like the portfolio managers that all you guys seem to want to be.
yeaaaaahhh…I guess when I think of someone managing money or doing the research it would be nice to have someone where that is their job. When I think FA, I think of someone trying to be everything to everyone, and spending the majority of time continuing to market and grow rather than really sit and manage portfolios. Plus the incentives are wack. Example from experience:The FA charges me 1% to manage my account, cool(not really, but cool enough). Then they realize that if they trade on the account they incur the ticket charge, reducing their compensation. So…the less trading the more profitable for them…conflict? Where is the line? I’d rather have it with someone who doesn’t face this dilemma, has the focus on just port mgmt, and who isn’t compd partially on the crap they put me in (A shares, cash value insurance, var annuities, etc). If all you do is manage money, then I do not consider that an FA, I would consider that a PM. I guess that is my disclaimer. But for all the people I have met who say they are FAs, none of them are just managing money, they are all doing other crap and most of that crap is detrimental towards managing the $. How much time can you be trading/researching when you are doing marketing events every day and client meetings all evening?
This ‘discussion’ sure digressed pretty quickly. Seems like alot of the criticism and cynicism about the ‘cliche’ FA is quite cliche in itself. It’s just as old hat, and isn’t much more value added.
its a shame that the “cliche” is the truth…I guess maybe it is common knowledge and doesn’t need to be expressed…but then it seems that there is always someone who wants to show how FAs have changed and are now the brightest and best thing. So I guess once in awhile the cliche needs to be repeated in my mind until someone can make a valid point on why FAs are anything to be respected, cheers.
tvPM Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > yeaaaaahhh…I guess when I think of someone > managing money or doing the research it would be > nice to have someone where that is their job. When > I think FA, I think of someone trying to be > everything to everyone, and spending the majority > of time continuing to market and grow rather than > really sit and manage portfolios. > > Plus the incentives are wack. Example from > experience:The FA charges me 1% to manage my > account, cool(not really, but cool enough). Then > they realize that if they trade on the account > they incur the ticket charge, reducing their > compensation. So…the less trading the more > profitable for them…conflict? Where is the line? > I’d rather have it with someone who doesn’t face > this dilemma, has the focus on just port mgmt, and > who isn’t compd partially on the crap they put me > in (A shares, cash value insurance, var annuities, > etc). > I’ve never heard of a PM account where trades reduce the FAs compensation. and very few FAs do marketing events every day.
tvPM Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > its a shame that the “cliche” is the truth…I > guess maybe it is common knowledge and doesn’t > need to be expressed…but then it seems that > there is always someone who wants to show how FAs > have changed and are now the brightest and best > thing. So I guess once in awhile the cliche needs > to be repeated in my mind until someone can make a > valid point on why FAs are anything to be > respected, cheers. the fact is that there are MANY different types of FAs and putting them all in the “selling annuities to grandma and cold calling 7 hours a day” basket is about as fair as putting all lawyers in the chasing ambulances basket. and frankly a i think the snotty attitude on this board has a lot to do with jealousy since most here could never do what many FAs do, and many here are just plain ignorant.
oskigo Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > tvPM Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > its a shame that the “cliche” is the truth…I > > guess maybe it is common knowledge and doesn’t > > need to be expressed…but then it seems that > > there is always someone who wants to show how > FAs > > have changed and are now the brightest and best > > thing. So I guess once in awhile the cliche > needs > > to be repeated in my mind until someone can make > a > > valid point on why FAs are anything to be > > respected, cheers. > > > the fact is that there are MANY different types of > FAs and putting them all in the “selling annuities > to grandma and cold calling 7 hours a day” basket > is about as fair as putting all lawyers in the > chasing ambulances basket. I’m okay with that. > and frankly a i think > the snotty attitude on this board has a lot to do > with jealousy since most here could never do what > many FAs do, and many here are just plain > ignorant.
How much time can you be > trading/researching when you are doing marketing > events every day and client meetings all evening? My best friend is a successful FA and he often says one of his main jobs is to keep his clients from doing silly things like trading. He doesn’t chase hot stocks or hot mutual funds, he is primarily a motivator and planner, helping people figure out how much they need to save, the right allocation for their life circumstances, and proper tax planning. It’s not rocket science and he doesn’t need to spend much time trading/researching.
Thats fine, just don’t tell people you are a pro in invesment management…cuz in reality he isn’t. I have no prob with FAs helping people who can’t motivate or discipline their savings or dont know what tax-deferred means, but saying that the FA is some investment guru is a long-shot (yep, there are the exceptions…my point is it shouldnt be the exception, it should be the standard). And as far as wrap accts that reduce the FAs comp, any independent FA should be paying for transactions, which ultimately will lower their comp. This may not be the case as an employee FA at some wirehouse, but it does exist and I have seen the statements of expenses to prove it. To end, any job posting that refers to “unlimited income potential”, and “teachers, construction workers, and newpaper delivery boys become successful FAs every day” is gong to continue to draw a raised eyebrow. If you want the profession to be respected by not only by those jealous losers that got picked on in high school on this forum, but the general public, maybe there needs to be some changes made…
aldford Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > How much time can you be > > trading/researching when you are doing > marketing > > events every day and client meetings all > evening? > > > My best friend is a successful FA and he often > says one of his main jobs is to keep his clients > from doing silly things like trading. He doesn’t > chase hot stocks or hot mutual funds, he is > primarily a motivator and planner, helping people > figure out how much they need to save, the right > allocation for their life circumstances, and > proper tax planning. It’s not rocket science and > he doesn’t need to spend much time > trading/researching. Good point! I guess you can somewhat rationalize a loaded charge if that FA can get the person to save, develop a plan, and guide them through life changes. Without that load there would be no incentive to educate the small investors. I think we just feel it is a rip off because we know how to do these things. I would feel guilty charging them but you are providing a service of education.
Well, this thread is an enlightening read into the mentality of a particular slice of the financial profession. A wee bit embarrassing. Not sure why a construction worker, like myself, with a small niche outfit that can pull an easy 6 figures by working as much or as little as I’d like - even in a housing deflationary environment- would want to get into the industry… A question for me to ponder some more while I take off early today so I can go home, close out the rest of the green put side of my straddle on the SPY, and set up the BBQ for the start of a long weekend in celebration of the 4th. Good luck financial gurus!
I am not sure what that post was supposed to do… if it was a jab at my comment about job postings then you misread. It would be no different if I were to read an ad for any other profession that should require some sort of experience, expertise, or knowledge to conduct (ornate tiling, pipefitting, doctor, etc) and it stated that basically anyone with a pulse is qualified…that is what is scary to me. Enjoy your BBQ…and your pondering.
tvPM- You should look at it as such that there are FA’s of various skill to fill the needs of investors of various skill. It’s no different than any other business…I’m not sure why you have a particular vehemence towards FA’s. In the words of a wise man: “Financial Advisors, although slow and dangerous behind the wheel, can still serve a purpose. I’ll be right back. Don’t you go dying on me!”
I don’t have vehemence, perhaps it is that all of the FAs I have seen have formulated my opinion, or to talk more CFA-curriculumish you would say I believe my sample is representative of the population. Whether that is accurate or not I do not know entirely, but haven’t seen anything to really prove me wrong yet. Maybe all I know are low-quality FAs dealing with low need clients…while I doubt it, who knows. I hope everyone else who thinks FAs are great is right and that someday I bump into one, until then I am not going to be convinced or give them a high-5. I should also state that I have FA friends, many, so its not that I hate them, I just see them as salespeople first, then motivational speakers, then maybe somewhere down the line investment people…agree to disagree.
you have a terrible attitude. there are plenty of FAs and institutional salespeople that are every bit as much an “investment person” as your average PM. in fact many of them used to be PMs before they realized that a lot more fun could be had in sales.
I’m an FA. I don’t screw my clients, I do LOTS of homework, and I spend every bit as much time on the phone with my existing clients as I do “selling” to new ones. I have never lost a client due to performance issues, service issues, etc. since I started 8 years ago. And I can probably tell you more about any one of the individual securities I own for my clients than a collection of 25 random “brokers” you may find out there could tell you about any one thing they own for people. I care enough about this that I started the CFA program to add an extra layer of creditability and to make myself better at my job so I can have some more value add for my clients. Its nice to be generalized though…
credibility