School Name / Starting Median Salary / Mid-Career Median Salary 1. Dartmouth College: $58,200 / $129,000 2. Massachusetts Institute of Technology (MIT): $71,100 / $126,000 3. Harvard University: $60,000 / $126,000 4. Harvey Mudd College: $71,000 / $125,000 5. Stanford University: $67,500 / $124,000 6. Princeton University: $65,000 / $124,000 7. Colgate University: $51,900 / $122,000 8. University of Notre Dame: $55,300 / $121,000 9. Yale University: $56,000 / $120,000 10. University of Pennsylvania: $60,400 / $118,000 http://hotjobs.yahoo.com/career-articles-college_grads_which_ones_earn_the_most-1103
Those mid-career stats suck balls dontcha think? I mean really bad all things considered.
Didn’t know colgate U is that high.
Please don’t use words like “dontcha”. But anyway, if you want my input as someone who went to one of those schools, I will point out that the mid-career statistics are useless for this reason: The definition of “Mid-Career”: “Mid-Career Employees: These are full-time employees with at least 10 years of experience in their career or field who hold a bachelor’s degree and no higher degrees.” “No higher degrees” means they are filtering out the highest-earning people from these schools. The survey does not count MBAs, lawyers, doctors, engineers with MS degrees, college professors, or basically anyone else who has had the initiative to improve themselves academically after graduating from college. A more suitable title for this survey is “salaries of the worst graduates” from these colleges. The starting salaries look about right, though. This post is not meant to discredit SMIRK, who should generally be lauded for posting broad interest articles.
Hello Mister Walrus Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Please don’t use words like “dontcha”. > Huh, I was going all American English for you. That’s gratitude.
Surprised to see Colgate on the list, and that comp at Harvey Mudd is so high. As an aside, I know Harvey Mudd is a good school, though I don’t actually know anyone who went there.
Harvey Mudd is one the best engineering college for undergrad so I am not surprised.
numi Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Surprised to see Colgate on the list, and that > comp at Harvey Mudd is so high. As an aside, I > know Harvey Mudd is a good school, though I don’t > actually know anyone who went there. I do 
they should do a survey that somehow reflects the relationship between parent and student income though… meaning what schools offer the most opportunities to ‘jump’ out of ones social circle. Interesting though, even thought the math/science schools are totally expected as most grads would be going into areas that actually have demand and decent starting wages vs poetry major grads/
UoP just missed this list at 11th. BRB I’ve got a study session w/ Larry Fitzgerald.
BC was 12th.
Did you consider that the $120+K/year salary might just be the base? Now, obviously, for a lot of positions, all-in comp isn’t so much higher than base, but that could explain some of it. Also, I graduated from one of those colleges and elected not to get a higher degree. I was promoted to a post-MBA position, and it simply didn’t make financial sense at that point to stop out for 2 years and pay $100K to eventually get a position I already have. I may be paid a little less over the long run and may run into some bias in hiring, but it’s a little unfair to suggest that people who don’t get advanced degrees are necessarily among the “worst graduates” of these colleges.
There are always exceptions. However, in general, advanced degrees are correlated with higher income.
That’s true. I’m just being defensive
Muddahudda Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Those mid-career stats suck balls dontcha think? I > mean really bad all things considered. In terms of the AF income scale, these salaries are d@mn near poverty-level.
I’d like to see the mid-career (15 years out of undergrad, 10 years out of bschool) average income for someone from one of those schools and an MBA from Harvard, Stanford, Wharton, Booth, or Sloan. How about someone from top 10 UG, top 5 MBA, and CFA? Any guesses? I’d go with 350 for UG+MBA and 400 for UG+MBA+CFA…obviously this calculation is off the top of my head and takes into account people who live in lower cost of living areas. In NYC and other major money markets, I’d expect this to increase substantially. I’m not saying the CFA adds 50K annually on a stand-alone basis; rather that those with the CFA would more likely be in higher paying sectors (i.e. money management as opposed to general management) and thus have higher compensation on average. I’m surprised that Dartmouth is #1 and Colgate is #7. Both excellent schools for sure, but probably helped by the substantial contingent of well-connected WASPs more than any other factor. I’m not knocking either - I have strong ties to both.
It probably helps Dartmouth and Colgate that there is a 10% margin of error on each side, according to the survey authors.
Here’s a question: Lets say you could pick any Undergrad school and MBA with the stipulation being that you could choose a top 5 school for only one of the buckets, what would your choices be and why? The first thing that popped into my head was USC undergrad and Stanford for MBA. Why? Great SoCal network from USC along with hot girls, amazing sports, and 4 years of good times. The Stanford MBA would validate my career potential and allow me to network with the least douchy of the (douchy) H/S/W crowd. Granted, I’d be west coast centric, but I’d take it! There likely wouldn’t be a job/deal in California that I couldn’t network my way into. Duke+HBS would be an interesting combo for the east coast…but the douche factor would likely break me.
^ hahah. Funny post by Hello Mister Walrus To be frank, with all the preoccupation about what’s “top X” vs “top Y” or whatever, I think a lot of these studies are pretty pointless. Most of the people at the top business schools would have been successful without an MBA. I’m going back to school to most likely transition industries…certainly it would have been harder to accomplish this without an MBA, but I think it would still have been possible. And frankly, I think once you’re in the top bucket of business schools, people in the long run are going to judge you on what you’ve done in the workforce. With that said, there’s definitely some merit to the argument that going to a top business school helps give you better business fundamentals and connections, but once you’re in a certain class of school, I don’t know that the curriculum and coursework really vary that much from one school to another. I know most people that are incoming MBA’s are probably drinking their Kool-Aid from whatever school they’re going to, but I’m trying to keep things practical. I’ve spoken with MBA’s from all the top schools, and the ones that are 10-15 years out of school all say that while it’s nice to have the alumni network, what matters most is what you actually do in the workplace, not where you went to school. One of the people in my own alumni network, who is in his late 30’s doing investment management, says that worrying about where someone went to business school at his age is akin to someone judging you based on where you went to middle school once you enter the workforce after graduation. Personally, I’ve lately been more frequently contemplating the costs and benefits of attending business school. I’m looking at $150K in expenses over the next two years, which is pretty sobering. Even worse, if the economy doesn’t improve, I’ll be facing the same challenges in recruiting as students at all schools are now. The one consolation is that the estimated expenses for any school in the top 15 or 20 is are pretty comparable. I’m sure some people will say that my attending what’s generally regarded as a top 3 business school will open doors for me in the future, but I don’t think anyone is so foolhardy to think that just having an MBA from *any* school equates to great pay. At the end of the day, employers will always ask themselves, “What have you done for us lately?” People get paid to produce…otherwise, they get bounced.
Is Colgate a toothpaste in the US too?
As a quick follow-up, I’m sure some of you are probably thinking that my post above contradicts the notion that MBA is significant value-add. Well, I do think that having an MBA can add a lot of value to your career and I’m hoping that I learn a lot during my time there. However, my decision to attain an MBA was influenced as much by my perceived desire (vs. need) for one, as well as the fact that it’s somewhat of a risk mitigator and that I was just ready to go back to school. I think that having an MBA will add credibility to my resume and eliminate some potential downside career risk. However, I feel that ultimately, in the long run, my career success will be defined by what happens in the years after graduation and eventually the MBA degree itself will just be another data point on my resume/CV.